This is a big issue. Just by being a citizen

of a country, you are denied to contribute to Open Source software: https://youtu.be/L5Ec5jrpLVk?si=1iIuHnMPbCB4anV-

One of the most ridiculous things I've seen. Before this, developers would argue over "ideology" but now it's about nationality. You'd think out of all people, developers would have more common sense but nope...

this is usually called "discrimination"

This is so relatable for us Iranians.

It is not arguing over ideology, it is legal sanctions, they have to do this, same with iranian devs for the same reasons: sanctions. Go bother governments that make the rules.

People shouldn't follow absurd rules. If nobody in Linux Foundation complied with these insane rules, what would the US government do? Jail all of them and jeopardize one of the most important projects of all time? Not to mention Torvalds explicitly liked this, which is the reason I no longer like him as a person

It is not the US government, it is the Finish government because the joined NATO too. And no, they would not jail them, they would free their assets (aka their money)

Also yes, Torvalds liked this, his country has been under Russian threat for the past 100 years, including a full on war. They have mandatory military training because Russia is still threatening them, they have a third of their taxes going to their military because Russia is there, their schools and stadiums have bunkers in them because Russia is there.

Which in turn would make them leave Linux behind. Engineers are replaceable BUT it'll take time, it wouldn't be sensible for the NATO or whatever to do this. Either way, the rules themselves are problematic.

Doesn't make it right to label all the Russian people as the same entity

It labels the country, not the people. You want back in? Go to another country where you would not pay taxes to Russia or Iran. As simple as that

its not that simple)

Do you really think it's that easy? I know rule makers aren't sensible but I didn't know people were THIS compliant as well

Well, I can't trade with Russia or Iran as well. I want to be able to use my bank account to buy food so that is not something I can do. Inspections are frequent, I had 2 controls this year and had to provide information on all my foreign customers because of all this

I'm not talking about trade sanctions. I'm talking about regular citizens that are not in any way affiliated with their government being able to contribute to open source projects.

Do they pay their taxes in Russia? If yes, they are affiliated to the Russian government

Citizens from countries under sanctions are affected by the sanctions. That's when you know the sanctions work

Affiliated as in directly working for the government, whether they're directly involved in the war or not. Some citizens cannot leave their country and they should not be banned from using open source software either

Affiliated = pays taxes is how economic sanctions work. They aim at a very simple rule. If it pays taxes to Russia it is sanctioned, whether an NGO, denizen, or company

Afaik the US allows people (rich people, of course) to have a dual citizenship in the US, wherever they're from (could be Russia). If they're trying to label every citizen as a contributer to wars, why are they allowing them to have a dual citizenship? The hypocrisy is obvious. You're not allowed anywhere unless you have the money and pay up. This is how you're unaffected by these "sanctions"

If they don't pay taxes in Russia, they do not care. And people that had money and dual citizenships of any kind left Russia already

Here's the thing, and this is also a reason why I won't ever take up US citizenship, once you have it it's very hard to give up. Also you have to pay taxes to the US as a US citizen irrespective of where in the world you are.

They can always go back though? Come to the US, enjoy your experience of being free of restrictions, and then go back to your "sanctioned" country whenever you want. It's not like we applied those sanctions to put pressure on all of the citizens in the first place :)

Here's the thing, if you dislike your government stop supporting them and work to change the situation

If you do that, from the moment you pay taxes in a sanctioned country, you may get flagged. That is how you end up on a no-fly list

And it's also a quick way to get your US assets siezed

Yep, that is the point of economic sanctions: force the citizens to change things from within

Yep

And then get killed in the process :) Nobody is willing to give up his life fighting cruel dictators

And that's why the countries stay suppressed.

Not true. Afaik Iranian officials send their family/children abroad to countries like the US and Canada, while easily supporting them with money. Their families are free to come back any time they desire (and pay taxes in their "sanctioned" country)

Yep, children do not pay taxes, very common loophole

They're not under the age of 18 though :) You can look up this story, it's very disturbing and shows the hypocrisy of US sanctions

F1 student visa, you just need to be enrolled at a US university. That's how it works, even from sanctioned countries

The story goes on to mention they're a bunch of spoiled free loaders, of no use in any way. All I'm trying to say is, these sanctions are hypocritical and only affect the unfortunate people. The rich always find a way out.

If the rich find a way out it is by, like I said before, by not paying taxes, taxes that would be used to buy weapons or rent mercenaries, that they do not pay, so you complain that rich people skirt the rules? Of course they do, if you have a problem with it, go 1917 on them

It's periodical. They fly between the countries and enjoy their time. Not to mention that so many of them hold Russian assets in Russia, that is making them money and hence is paying taxes in there as well. It just shows that the US is willing to turn a blind eye when it comes to money. These sanctions are more like virtue-signals that the US loves

You're really stuck on this US thing eh

Many ways to skirt that, French companies skirt that by opening a company in Russia and making it a different company. The rich are always annoying, but sadly they tend to have pretty tight security

I mean we are (were?) talking about the fact that Russian developers can no longer contribute to Linux, which is the result of the US sanctions

Not just US, and in that case, not US at all, Finnish

No offense but I think you're just trying to play around the issue and ignore what I'm trying to say. What I previously said is a fact, probably a loop hole, that is left untouched for years, for known reasons.

Have you envisioned that those rich people probably do not go to the US but to literally any country where Russia is not sanctioned? Because there are lots of them

I'm not trying to lash out and be disrespectful but NATO countries don't really have a say, they just follow US orders. So it all comes back to USA

Egypt for example

Does it matter who issues sanctions when there is a clear cut reason why they are issued?

There are a lot of them in the US as well. Iran and US are mortal enemies, yet Iranian officials are easily able to send their family abroad to countries like Canada and the US. Really shows the effectiveness of these sanctions 😉

No but it's the US issuing them, which is why we're talking about them

I explained that already, children don't pay taxes, send them on a student visa, go visit them, easy

Listen, I hate the US just as much as the next guy, but in that case the sanctions are pretty easy to justify

They have dual citizenship, and are not children. I feel like you're intentionally ignoring facts to make up your story. I need to eat. It was a joy talking to you, although we didn't reach a conclusion and thus have to agree to disagree

Give a concrete example, because most rich people from Iran are on the no-fly list or the no-contact list, which I have a copy of because trading with them means being put on the list

students don't pay tax, just rent and tuition

Стикер

Стикер

1- It is. 2- Didn't he call the people who objected this decision "Russian trolls"?.

Thanks for admitting you make shit up, the door is that way.

You are the one making things up, not providing sources, and attacking the other side of the argument. lol

Стикер

Do you have sources that prove me otherwise? no? Alright

Your attempts to troll and waste people's time are transparent, try harder

You're the troll. We were respectfully debating on an important matter, if you lack the proper etiquette there's no need to get yourself involved in grown men discussions.

Even harder, with a chocolate cake recipe thrown into the mix please.

Excuse me, but you're just another person who has fallen for the dumb propoganda fed to you by your fascist government. Your real problem is with your government, but you and everyone else who "condemns" your government is too shit scared of doing anything about it. Nobody is coming to save you, save yourself

What are you even talking about lol? I can go days talking about who's the actual fascist but that's for another discussion which is unrelated

r u russian?

What do you think

Does it matter where I'm from? What matters are opinions

i think not russian.

Some middle eastern shithole most likely

like iraq or syria?

Sometimes India too, inforwars work on a global level and it does not help when the country is dependent on Russia/China.

india is both a shithole and heaven